Ausman
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Posts posted by Ausman
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Hi all,
I'd like to see a change in the way the forum displays answers. At present there are many members who don't get immediate posting of their responses. Whilst I agree with this in some ways, it also creates problems. The main one is multiple answering about an issue, which is annoying for those who take the trouble to do so. They craft a response and then find they look a bit silly because up pops the same answer above them when things finally get displayed.
If the "immediate posting for all" rule is never going to be implemented, then I feel that the forum should generate a message saying that a "response has been had from member X, but is not up yet pending moderator approval" etc etc.
The classic case of this is the answers from Henny and Isakovic here:
Henny elaborates well whilst Isak give the overview of the same answer. I see this same sort of thing many times and I feel it is time for something to be changed. I acknowledge that it might be slowing a correct answer a bit, but generally if people answer on this forum they give good advice.
Alternatively, allow immediate posting after a much smaller number of posts than present. To my eye it looks like Isak and Henny are not on immediate posting, but they are both great people to have on the forum with good advice when they can help. Many others are the same, so perhaps some careful study is needed to allow immediate posting to those members who have similar value.
cheers,
Aus
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Well done.
How big are the plants? I'd personally love to have a permanent river running through my place that I could extract power from!
cheers,
Aus
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Hi Flex,
that's a strange one. I have no trouble like that, but I am still using 9.7.55. However, have you been using other PLC maker's programs? Rockwell in particular was exceptionally good at stuffing up/taking over without asking/wrecking a perfect system/you get the idea my 232 port settings. I'd uninstall all your com ports and ensure that the driver used during reboot and discovery is the standard one for your ports and m/board, then try again. And make sure through task manager that nothing else is running that could be using the port...some of the other programs' services are an auto startup.
From memory you also use Version Swapper, so have you tried an older Visi to see if it works ok?
And for the creators, I have since checked the event log in Visi and there in the record is evidence of every start of the program opening the 232 com port and immediately closing it again.
So I'm assuming that RA does the same thing. Why does it do this? It is obviously why my problem occurred. It shouldn't open any port until requested.cheers,
Aus
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Thanks Clint.
Re SDW59. It's all pretty self-explanatory.
If you are ever bored, instead of getting a coffee, go cruising through the System operands. I still find things I didn't know about, or didn't have a previous need for which meant they weren't stored in the grey matter. ......Oh alright then, you can get the coffee to have whilst you do this!
cheers,
Aus
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Hi again all,
today I was working with another brand of plc hooked directly into my system with 232. During the course of events I was checking remote site operations using Remote Access running on TCP Call. As I closed the session up popped a request box saying "Do you want to close the modem connection?" Huh? What modem?
After a bit of puzzling I realised it was the other plc on the serial line making the strange shutdown happening, with Remote Access thinking there was a modem there. I turned it off and the problem went away. But it does give rise to the question as to why Remote Access was even looking at the 232 line, when I was only using TCP. If you do the same thing in Visi, it shows the "modem connected" box whilst opened. I know this scenario is a bit unusual, but perhaps there is something wrong in the connection area of the program that needs looking at. To my thinking, if you are only using TCP, and your programs open to those settings as default, why is Visi/RA/etc still monitoring the serial com port? It/they shouldn't even be thinking about it!
cheers,
Aus
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THIS is a REAL bug.
Obviously........because it is able to hang upside down seeings how it is in the Southern Hemisphere.
cheers,
Aus
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I know this is a dumb question, but is your USB-serial adapter actually 232, or 485? You say above that it works ok to poll Modbus registers, so in theory this implies it is a 485 unit. Yet to access the 350 via serial from Visi as discussed during the thread, it needs 232, not 485. (as far as I know....happy to be told otherwise!)
And a later edit: Again perhaps I am wrong, but further to this observation, if you are indeed getting into the unit on 485 with an existing cable, perhaps you need to get a correct cable as well. If you are getting in on 485, you are in theory accessing pins 1 & 6, which won't work for Visi. Check out cable pinout diagrams.
cheers,
Aus
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In theory a self-resetting timer set at 60 seconds will count to the minute, but there are innate scan time variations involved which cause errors over time.
For all my minute by minute logging I need it done exactly on the minute, so that it can be correctly interpreted into Excel later. I use an = 0 comparison on SI30, which turns on an MB. I then use a positive transition of this MB to activate the log row write. The logging row itself includes time and date for reference/display in Excel.
For different "on the minute, but at minute multiples" counts, you can achieve the same thing with simple revolving count comparisons on SI36 triggering the MB.
cheers,
Aus
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On 01/11/2016 at 0:13 AM, Flex727 said:
It's always better to break up outputs to have a single one for each rung
And here I was thinking I was old-fashioned in sticking to this routine. Glad to see someone else always does this!
And thanks Joe for the STL View explain about recompiling.
cheers,
Aus
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On 20/10/2016 at 4:37 AM, gdamat said:
why to approve my message content by a moderator takes so long?
Hi Gdamat,
I think that most of the moderators on this forum work in the real world, they are not someone who sits mindlessly looking at forums all the time. They might also be on the other side of the world...this is a "global" forum. After you have posted a certain number of times, and indicated willingness to persist and be polite, you shift to immediate posting. Personally I don't have trouble with this to keep the forum orderly, although it is a bit painful when you first join and want information now!
+1 to Joe's answer. It also encompasses my other reason for using expansions on a bare PLC......it makes it cheaper if something ever needs replacing. The only time I go for onboard is if I am running out of IOs via expansions.
And just for a laugh re the door comment, in one of my jobs I had to mount 2 fully loaded PLCs, IOs and other gear onto the door due to very restricted space. It was interesting getting about 280 lines within 4 or 7 core screened cables into a suitable series of flexing configurations that went onwards to multiple arrays of din rail. I guess that abbreviates down to "a pain in the butt"!
cheers,
Aus
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Hi Wassim,
I see no image in your post after "shows the following", so I can only add to what Flex has said, and that is to make sure that you have matching baud rates in device manager and Visilogic, normally 57600. I have had instances of no connection when the setting in device manager is not the same.
Other than that, perhaps have a good read of all the ideas in this other post, to follow up what Flex has said about drivers:
cheers,
Aus
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Hi Crazi and welcome,
The answer is yes....possibly! You might be getting into "PLC program intellectual property issues" here, too.
The problem is that it may be password protected, or that the program loaded into the 350 is not the type that enables uploading. You can only really find out by accessing the unit with VisiLogic via either the serial port or ethernet. Upon correct connection, Visi will tell you what it finds.
If you find that you can't get the program these ways, check what is on the micro SD card if one is fitted. There may be a user program or total backup stored there, but again you might need a password. If the unit does have a micro SD in the slot, use the Info mode to go to System and explore the SD card from there. If any user program comes up then it may or may not be the one in use, (compare it to the name of the program in use...also accessible via Info mode) and it may or may not have a password. You can pull the card and get into it directly if needed.
I have left out many of the steps involved here as it is all fairly straightforward and logical.
Cheers,
Aus
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Hi all,
just a heads up to something I discovered today. I still am on Win 7 for my main computer system. I think that a recent Win update upset my date settings severely.
I discovered that date entries into Excel were not going in properly. With different number combinations it was always displaying a mishmash of American or Australian date method, with seemingly random change of day/date position. (USA 3rd of November is 11/03/2016 and Aus is 03/11/2016) No matter what I did with cell formats etc the problem would not go away. Given that I use Excel a fair bit in my work and date sorting/entry is important, this was an issue and lead to more hair removal.
I eventually discovered that many of my locale settings had been changed to USA standard, but not in every relevant area of the registry. I had to go through Region & Language, change everything away from correct, apply and close, and then do it correctly and apply again etc. I haven't installed or altered anything else on this puter apart from some updates coming through, so I'm blaming Msoft. If you're in the States you probably won't be affected, but if you are elsewhere and weird things start happening in this area, check it out.
It was initially very perplexing, and my eventual registry check at HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Control Panel\International sShortDate showed up the discrepancy, and I went from there. I think that because of the mismatches in the registry, the poor old system was confused and didn't know what to do.
Are you there, HAL? I enjoy working with Humans, Dave! (Especially when I send you crazy!!!)
cheers,
Aus
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Hi Tony,
+1 on Joe & Cliff, (who posted before your reply became available due to the "moderator lag").
Further to the limiting resistor, I have had the same situation with an AI available when DIs were full. But I needed a few of them. With careful selection of resistor values, you can actually make an AI read a few DIs, rather than just one. It was a bit fiddly getting values just right (due to tolerances), doing code to interpret the various AI amounts, testing in situ of all the combinations etc. but was well worth it to save adding a module. ie Dig 1 reads 1V, dig 2 & 4 together read 5V etc. Just something to keep in mind in case you need another one!
cheers,
Aus
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Hi Hilton & Roberto (?),
Given that 2 people seem to have an issue, it sounds like Win update has broken something in the later versions, so it is probably time for the creators to step in. I am still only running 9.7.55 and don't have any issues after the latest updates. My main Unitronics puter is only 7 32 Home Premium, and I have no need to update when 9.7.55 works fine for my needs.
But to get you going, perhaps you have enough System Restore capacity/points to go back to something that works ok? As in, prior to the most recent Win updates? Depends on your System Restore size settings, I personally don't have it very large as I regularly do partition copies as part of my backup routine.
Sorry, that's all I can offer at present.
cheers,
Aus
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Hi Sremac,
Every time I have used Swapper with latest versions etc I have found all sorts of errors pop up on opening versions that previously worked ok. The only way I was ever able to get around things was to uninstall them all and then redo them. This is tedious but worked. It is similar in principle to what I suggest in this post at post 2:
Perhaps you could spend a little time trying this method and see how it goes?
And a PS to Joe....we're getting old aren't we, to remember that!
cheers,
Aus
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Hi Hilton,
First up, did you do your original install as Administrator......right click on the install .exe and Run as Administrator?
And ensure you are running the program as Administrator, set from compatibility settings on the program .exe itself.
If you did this correctly and are still having issues, then I would do an uninstall/reinstall of the program (backup your data first in case of some issue).
If you didn't, do it all again noting the Admin settings.
cheers,
Aus
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+1 to Joe's post.
But seeings how you are working with a vacuum system, you really only need to display things once it gets down to certain levels. eg my refrig gauges only display digits below 500 microns.
It appears that you can change the outputs of the sensor to various vacuum levels, so you might be able to get the figures you need by reducing the span to very high vacuum zones.
If you can do this, but also do need to display vacuum through the entire range, then use 2 sensors with settings to suit and automatically switch between them.
cheers,
Aus
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Hi Vamal,
First up, it seems that you are in a bit of a bind with that actuator...it is one of the models in the Belimo range that doesn't have the modulating module option...not all of them do. However, more later on the fact that it does have a DO module.
Also, just making sure that you understand that I'm not saying change the valve, I'm saying just change the actuator.
If you can just change the actuator have a look at this: www.belimo.com.au/pdf/e/EV24A-SR-TPC_datasheet_en-gb.pdf
But......you have an actuator that is large, and therefore $ are higher if you choose to change it, which may influence your decision. But if you stick with Belimo (and I think they are good units) the only way in this size area you will get modulation seems to be to change the actuator. I would check with your local Belimo to make sure of this.
If you cannot change things at all, you could perhaps add the 2 x DO module. You could use this to get endpoint signals periodically, say every 24hours, which in theory then let you update your maths every day to work with theoretical position by checking the running time end to end. If the system has downtime this is simple, if it is on 24/7 then harder, but not impossible.
Theoretical/virtual position is in some ways not necessary anyway, if you move the valve and get the required result then you don't need to know where it is! But I have always found that modulation makes the process much smoother and is ultimately the easiest to implement.
Check with Belimo, they sometimes have more than the catalogue says!
cheers and good luck...
Aus
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Hi Rzas,
It looks like no-one has replied to this, so I'll have a quick go.
Yes it is possible, and there are myriad ways to go about it. At the very simplest level, write a small program that turns a MB on and off from a key input. Have that same MB directly running an Output, with both of them set to "None" in the Power up box. Power off, and then with power on the MB retains it's status, and therefore the physical outputs remain the same as when the PLC lost power. There are many more (sometimes complex) ways of doing what you want, but this shows you the basics. If your code will immediately alter these states on power up, you will need to put in delays, or programming that over-rides the code results initially.
I would be very careful retaining outputs on power up.....things like load shedding and correct interaction etc are very important. I never do this AT ALL. My devices all work from a sequenced startup, where the PLC initially stabilises it's readings and then powers everything up correctly.
cheers,
Aus
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Hi all, and specifically the creators.
I need enlightenment on whether M91s will cease production in a few years. I need to add to an install and am tossing up using another 2-T1 or going to something younger. They work fine for the application. But there is no point doing this if they won't be readily available in a few years.
I understand this might be a curly question to answer, but it would be nice to know directions things are going.
cheers,
Aus
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I agree with all that HiTech says, especially on Hercules...a great little program. Link: http://www.hw-group.com/products/hercules/index_en.html I suggest you play with it first to get to know it's fundamentals.
That manual for the printer is quite good, so concentrate on getting simple instructions received ok, like an LF and Full cut, then progress from there.
I have also had serial instances where inversion of lines 2 & 3 are needed despite manufacturer information describing normality/showing nothing about this. Once it was squirrelled away in troubleshooting...no mention at all in the main connections advice section. Dumb! If all else fails, give it a try. A breakout box makes this easy and is a great tool to have in the kit.
cheers, and again, good luck. Serial is sometimes a pain!
Aus
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As far as I know, some of the M91 series are 12V capable, but not the ones with analogue outputs. However, you might be able to add a simple 485 bus addition to them that can give you AOs. This might also work in better with your application if the bus module is close to your AO driven devices, with the PLC tucked away somewhere else. But your desired AO speed might also be an issue with this method.
cheers,
Aus
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Hi all,
I am actually in the large HVAC game, and all of the valves I've encountered similar to what Vamal is describing work via one input moves the valve in the closed direction, and the other moves it in the open direction. Whilst writing this, Joe's answer has popped up, and he has described a way of doing it. As he and Isak say, you can do timed pulses and work on theoretical position.
However, in all of my instances I have given up on the actuator in question as you never really know where the valve is in it's span. I have always changed the actuator to a modulating type, which is generally very easy to do. I do acknowledge that some of the bigger valves have all of the actuation mechanism as a dedicated part of the valve body. But nearly all of the 3 ways I see in HVAC have an easily changed actuator. To save lots of headaches and enable much better control, I strongly suggest changing it. For most of mine it is a couple of hundred$ max.
There also is the cheaper possiblity that most actuators are able to have an add-on analogue output module attached. This is another way of achieving the same aim, but you end up needing 2 DOs and 1 AI and it is often easier just to change to the different actuator, which in my cases means I then need 1AO and 1AI. And for those who puzzle why an AI, my systems always check that the valve in question is responding correctly.
And an FYI edit: make sure the system is correctly balanced, to ensure smooth temp transitions.
cheers,
Aus
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Forum notification of answer not put up yet.
in We're Listening...
Posted
I agree, Henny, I find this very frustrating. It has reached the stage where, before answering, I carefully consider whether the OP should be doing more themselves.
I think that over the last year on the forum this poor behaviour has increased. Perhaps it is because more youngies are coming onto the scene. At one stage I thought that it looked like we had a whole crop of uni students doing assignments using Unitronics gear, wanting maximum help and ideas for minimal effort.
In the old days, we had to look at help files and operations manuals, experiment, spend brain power and lots of time time figuring things out ourselves. Now you can just ask the internet, and some sucker somewhere will help out with what might be the right answer that you can then take credit for with no thanks where due. It seems a sad fact of modern society that basic manners and moral values seem to be disappearing.
But to counter that we do still see the polite posters who respond promptly and have obviously tried, so I appreciate their thanks and don't mind helping them. And there are times when I am truly stumped on a complex issue I've studied intensely, and look to the forum for help or observations. To my mind, that's really what it is for.
cheers,
Aus