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v1040 lost GSM modem connection after OS update


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On 3/3/2022 at 5:25 AM, Ausman said:

Vken, was the real  lesson this one?......:

https://forum.unitronics.com/topic/7245-dont-update-just-because-you-can/

cheers, Aus

I agree with Ausman but to be fare, unitronics forces you to download a new OS if have a most recent version of visilogic, and at the same time download page is like this:

 

image.thumb.png.7c20569b4c186b9334d88580ee3d78fc.png

 

So unless you actualy knew before hand that unitronics does not do the best job managing its software updates, you are more likely to screw it up if you happen to be using a very brand new computer 

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1 hour ago, Fernando Castro said:

So unless you actualy knew before hand that unitronics does not do the best job managing its software updates, you are more likely to screw it up if you happen to be using a very brand new computer 

I disagree. It is incumbent on the programmer to understand both the hardware and software he or she is using. Every time I get a new computer, I make sure I have all the VisiLogic versions I might need to do my job. To just blindly download the latest version and begin updating the software on a PLC without understanding what you're doing is foolish. Further, VisiLogic alerts you immediately when you try to open a project that was previously saved with an older version.

What you call Unitronics not doing the best job in managing its software updates, I call Unitronics being extremely responsive to customer requests to improve its software. I am very appreciative of those improvements and even more appreciative for not having to pay thousands to buy the programming software and other utilities they provide for free.

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23 minutes ago, Flex727 said:

To just blindly download the latest version and begin updating the software on a PLC without understanding what you're doing is foolish.Further, VisiLogic alerts you immediately when you try to open a project that was previously saved with an older version.

Of course, if you were using Unitronics before, what about those that are using Unitronics for the very first time?

Picture this you just bought a v700 and then OS  4.010.34 can not communicate using Modbus

And you find that the issue was OS just because a random dude on the forum was bitching about how Unitronics does not do the best job managing their updates pointed that out.
.... this just happened for someone recently: 

[SOLVED] V700 Modbus TCP/IP slave - Vision & Samba PLC + HMI Controllers & VisiLogic Software - Unitronics Support Forum: Programmable Controllers (PLC + HMI All-in-One)

 

21 minutes ago, Flex727 said:

What you call Unitronics not doing the best job in managing its software updates, I call Unitronics being extremely responsive to customer requests to improve its software. I am very appreciative of those improvements and even more appreciative for not having to pay thousands to buy the programming software and other utilities they provide for free.

I do appreciate not paying thousands of dollars too, but you do know that not only Unitronics offers free software, right? 


I GUESS that most likely Unitronics is cheaper ( I Have no Idea If this is the case. I was hired to do controls engineering, and then discovered that the company uses this brand that was unknown to me before).


I may be seen as a detractor, but I am giving my opinion based on my experience using it from scratch so far, and I have had this experience before with other brands, I do not hesitate to use new technology. for the record, I appreciate a lot of cool features that Unitronics's Visilogic has, and at some point I am sure they were ahead of its time. 


I mean, I do make mistakes too. releasing changes with unexpected consequences happens, but I am just one random dude without previous knowledge of a particular system that I am trying to improve, which happens to have too many versions of every possible part, and an end-user that keeps asking for more features every time.


Unitronics is an entire company with many people developing and designing software and hardware, the expectations are higher.


so Unitronics needs to do a better job, everyone needs to keep pushing forward to improve.

 

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27 minutes ago, Fernando Castro said:

Of course, if you were using Unitronics before, what about those that are using Unitronics for the very first time?

Picture this you just bought a v700 and then OS  4.010.34 can not communicate using Modbus

And you find that the issue was OS just because a random dude on the forum was bitching about how Unitronics does not do the best job managing their updates pointed that out.

1) Training is important, especially so when dealing with industrial components.

2) Unitronics offers direct support, which I have found to be very responsive and helpful..

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This topic has wandered far off course, so perhaps some of it should be made into a new one where grievances can be specifically aired?

However......

Here's my car analogy again.  If you buy a second hand car and it needs some parts, you don't buy parts for the latest version, you get the software and physical parts that match the car's build dates and VIN number.  Some of those parts are common across all versions of the same model, but many aren't.  The follow on from this is that if you inherit a control system that uses a particular brand, you find out everything you can about the system BEFORE you do anything to it.  This includes the need to have a matching control program to what is in place.  (Which is where Info mode usage is essential)

I agree that the release of a bugged comm system in the latest release is not really excusable.  But in general I have found Unitronics reacts very quickly to major issues and fixes them.  I think this is mainly because they aren't a "huge" company and their staff interact all the time.  Unlike other brands who I have paid many thousands of $s to just for their control program that has an issue that sits for years.....because the arrogant "large corporation" maker refuses to acknowledge the problem...it is the "end user at fault"....until one day they finally discover for themselves the issue is theirs....as the "silly" end user has been telling them for ages.  Be thankful Unitronics is not run by Microsoft, otherwise you would have no choice as to how things would be run, and "undone" through continual (forced) updates.  And you would also get huge amounts of bloatware that you'll never use, instead of something that simply does the job without a host of other garbage included. 

I disagree with  

6 hours ago, Fernando Castro said:

too many versions of every possible part

I don't actually quite understand that statement.  Is it too many versions of OS?  All the parts are a single hardware item, some of which have inbuilt variations to enable configuration to exactly suit a job.

And this one:

6 hours ago, Fernando Castro said:

end-user that keeps asking for more features every time

pretty much relates to the "don't update" post I linked to.  If it ain't broke, works correctly and does the job perfectly, don't reinvent the wheel.  Leave it alone.  But sadly today's mindset is that continual change and "improvement" is seen as a must.  Sometimes the result is a good one, but many times it is a vastly backwards step.  The classic example is Windows, in that something that took a single click in XP, now takes multiple clicks to get to in W10.  Yet the users who are only used to the latest W10 don't understand the frustrations displayed by people who have been around longer than them. 

As an aside, I'm actually sick and tired of seeing 20 year olds (influencers especially!) saying "I've never seen anything like that".  That's because you're young  and "stupid" through not having the realworld experience older people do!

cheers, Aus

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I support Ausman words. One of my money-making tasks is backing up, reinstalling programs, and repairing damaged industrial controllers and machines.

And that's what strikes me very unpleasantly. Each version of Siemens hardware has its own version of expensive software. Omron, Schneider and others suffer from the same problems. The new PLCs have lost their previous reliability and change hardware versions very often.

And now I will say a good word about Unitronics engineers and programmers. It is a great fortune to develop a hardware platform that is so versatile, stable and efficient.

I have already quoted the guru - it is impossible to kill the Vision controller at the software level if it has a working hardware. Free software that constantly adds functionality is a real advantage.

Yes, I really liked version 9.8.65, but that doesn't mean I'm not exploring the possibilities of new versions. At the same time, we can safely migrate to a lower version of the PLC firmware and this does not cause problems with the hardware.

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1 hour ago, Ausman said:

This topic has wandered far off course, so perhaps some of it should be made into a new one where grievances can be specifically aired?

However......

Here's my car analogy again.  If you buy a second hand car and it needs some parts, you don't buy parts for the latest version, you get the software and physical parts that match the car's build dates and VIN number.  Some of those parts are common across all versions of the same model, but many aren't.  The follow on from this is that if you inherit a control system that uses a particular brand, you find out everything you can about the system BEFORE you do anything to it.  This includes the need to have a matching control program to what is in place.  (Which is where Info mode usage is essential)

I agree that the release of a bugged comm system in the latest release is not really excusable.  But in general I have found Unitronics reacts very quickly to major issues and fixes them.  I think this is mainly because they aren't a "huge" company and their staff interact all the time.  Unlike other brands who I have paid many thousands of $s to just for their control program that has an issue that sits for years.....because the arrogant "large corporation" maker refuses to acknowledge the problem...it is the "end user at fault"....until one day they finally discover for themselves the issue is theirs....as the "silly" end user has been telling them for ages.  Be thankful Unitronics is not run by Microsoft, otherwise you would have no choice as to how things would be run, and "undone" through continual (forced) updates.  And you would also get huge amounts of bloatware that you'll never use, instead of something that simply does the job without a host of other garbage included. 

I disagree with  

I don't actually quite understand that statement.  Is it too many versions of OS?  All the parts are a single hardware item, some of which have inbuilt variations to enable configuration to exactly suit a job.

And this one:

pretty much relates to the "don't update" post I linked to.  If it ain't broke, works correctly and does the job perfectly, don't reinvent the wheel.  Leave it alone.  But sadly today's mindset is that continual change and "improvement" is seen as a must.  Sometimes the result is a good one, but many times it is a vastly backwards step.  The classic example is Windows, in that something that took a single click in XP, now takes multiple clicks to get to in W10.  Yet the users who are only used to the latest W10 don't understand the frustrations displayed by people who have been around longer than them. 

As an aside, I'm actually sick and tired of seeing 20 year olds (influencers especially!) saying "I've never seen anything like that".  That's because you're young  and "stupid" through not having the realworld experience older people do!

cheers, Aus

I was talking about my specific project each "system" can have up to 2 variants of at least 6 components that the PLC has to control, also 2 versions of PLCs, and they should be interchangeable, so it is a pain in the ass to develop a single program that can run whatever combination  of parts you assembly on the same system. 

was an example from my day to day  change request are part of my day job because there is production and R&D in the company, just because something "works" it does not mean that everything should be unchanged... on my company we need to keep pushing forward to be ahead of our competitors. 

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13 hours ago, Fernando Castro said:

I was talking about my specific project each "system" can have up to 2 variants of at least 6 components that the PLC has to control, also 2 versions of PLCs, and they should be interchangeable, so it is a pain in the ass to develop a single program that can run whatever combination  of parts you assembly on the same system. 

I guess I don't understand this. Can you provide specifics? I don't know what 2 versions of PLCs means.

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21 hours ago, Fernando Castro said:

can have up to 2 variants of at least 6 components that the PLC has to control

wondering if you know about the little known ability to switch I/O configurations by changing SI205?

Look up the help files and use Search.  Enter Switch I/O  and find Switch I/O config in the resulting list.  This ability might be useful to you?

cheers, Aus

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On 3/5/2022 at 4:16 PM, Ausman said:

wondering if you know about the little known ability to switch I/O configurations by changing SI205?

Look up the help files and use Search.  Enter Switch I/O  and find Switch I/O config in the resulting list.  This ability might be useful to you?

cheers, Aus

This is indeed an amazing tool!!!.

I'll ckeck it out, thanks @Ausman, I may open a new topic to gather some ideas, I think that i have driven this topic,  "off-topic" a lot. 

 

 

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