V1210 Expansion Error

[Colodeti]

Hello,
I have an application with V1210 + EX-A2X expansion adapter + 2x IO-DI16 + 2x IO-RO16 + IO-D16A3-RO16 + IO-AI8 that is failing "Stop reasons: Expansion Error", I am unable to correct the failure, this project initially did not include the IO-D16A3-RO16 adapter, after installing this adapter that the failure started to occur, the project also has 96 interface relays, the 220Vac to 24Vdc converter with 5A current

[Ausman]

On the 16-16, have you got the input wiring configuration correct for using either NPN or PNP?  Is it matched to the setting in Hardware Setting of the Module, in Visilogic? 

All other wiring correctly done and linked to the D16-R16 according to the various install pdfs?

Confirm there is no snap-in on the 1210.

Please elaborate on your "96 interface relays".

cheers, Aus

[DanT]

Hi;

How Many  IO-D16A3+RO16 do you have?   1  or 4 ?

IF you Have Only 1  IO-D16A3-RO16   -- where did you place it in the sequence  -- Before or after the IO-AI8? ,  and did you adjust the Hardware Setup in the V1210 Accordingly?

If you have  4  IO-D16A3-RO16 then :

The EX-A2x can handle a Maximum  of 8 I/O Modules.

DI16 + DI16 + RO16+ RO16 + D16A3/RO16 + D16A3/RO16 + D16A3/RO16 + D16A3/RO16 + IO-AI8  = 9  Expansion!           (96 Relay Out )

IF THIS IS YOUR CASE, THEN you will have to remove the IO-AI8,  And Buy a  EX-RC1  and use the CANBUS Port  on the V1210 to talk to it and the IO-AI8

The EX-RC1  is an Expansion Port   Adapter  Module to add  more I/O modules to a Vision System.  It uses CANBUS protocol to interface to the V1210.

Under Help - Examples- V900-Communications-EX-RC1-EX-RC1 with Analog   - this will guide you for the Interface required for both the V1210 and the EX-RC1.

Also check Help.  The EX-RC1 has some smarts to do the communications and transfer the Data.  The EX-RC1  has to be programmed to set it up properly.

 

DanT

 

 

[Colodeti]

 

Hello the project was set up as follows: EX-A2X + 2xIO-DI16 + 2xIO-RO16 + IO-D16A3-RO16 + IO-AI8 I then modified and installed the IO-D16A3-RO16 right after the EX-A2X. What confused me the most is that the project only started to show this flaw after installing the IO-D16A3-RO16 card

[Colodeti]

On 09/02/2020 at 07:37, Ausman said:

Nos 16-16, você acertou a configuração da fiação de entrada para usar NPN ou PNP? É compatível com a configuração em Configuração de hardware do módulo, no Visilogic? 

Toda a outra fiação feita corretamente e ligada ao D16-R16 de acordo com os vários pdfs de instalação?

Confirme se não há snap-in no 1210.

Por favor, elabore seus "96 relés de interface".

Saúde, Aus

Hello dear

This project ran for two years without fail, the failure only occurred when the customer requested an expansion and we chose to install the IO-D16A3-RO16 card, when I take this card out and return with the old project the failure no longer occurs

[Joe Tauser]

Is that an official Unitronics Expansion Cable plugged into the EX-A2X or did you roll your own?  I don't know of any of the cables that are blue.  

The IO-D16A3-RO16 is a much newer design and I'm guessing it's pickier about bus connection than the older style modules.  Perhaps the Creators can expand on this.

Joe T. 

[Colodeti]

7 minutes ago, Joe Tauser said:

Esse cabo de expansão oficial da Unitronics está conectado ao EX-A2X ou você criou o seu? Não conheço nenhum dos cabos azuis.  

O IO-D16A3-RO16 é um design muito mais recente e acho que é mais exigente quanto à conexão de barramento do que os módulos de estilo mais antigos. Talvez os Criadores possam expandir isso.

Joe T. 

hello dear
The interconnection cable I created based on the original

[Joe Tauser]

Considering that you're getting an Expansion Error with a home-brewed cable, I would replace it.  You've already spent more time troubleshooting this than the cable costs.

 

Joe T.

[AlexUT]

Hi Colodeti,

Did you modified and downloaded to PLC new project file with added IO-D16A3-RO16?

System is not plug-and-play.

B.R.

 

[Colodeti]

8 hours ago, Joe Tauser said:

Considerando que você está recebendo um erro de expansão com um cabo fabricado em casa, eu o substituiria. Você já passou mais tempo solucionando problemas com isso do que os custos com cabos.

 

Joe T.

dear

I will try to do this test with the original cable that came with the EX-A2X and return on the result

[Colodeti]

4 hours ago, AlexUT said:

Olá Colodeti,

Você modificou e baixou para o PLC o novo arquivo de projeto com o IO-D16A3-RO16 adicionado?

O sistema não é plug-and-play.

BR

 

 

dear

yes, even before I had installed the D16A3 card at the penultimate point, as the failure occurred I changed the project and installed it right after the EX-A2X and even then the failure occurred again

[Ausman]

Are you SURE you have the wiring correct for NPN or PNP and ALSO have the NPN/PNP selection done correctly in the Project's Hardware Configuration? 

The PNP/NPN selection is in the left column of the Digital Inputs Tab in Hardware Configuration and is easily missed.  Once done, you must compile this, save as new, reload it into the controller and do an Init and Reset.

I also notice in the photos that it looks like you are only using one input on the AI8.  You could perhaps get rid of this module completely by using the AI on the D16A3.

cheers, Aus

[Gabriel Franco]

3 hours ago, Ausman said:

Are you SURE you have the wiring correct for NPN or PNP and ALSO have the NPN/PNP selection done correctly in the Project's Hardware Configuration? 

The PNP/NPN selection is in the left column of the Digital Inputs Tab in Hardware Configuration and is easily missed.  Once done, you must compile this, save as new, reload it into the controller and do an Init and Reset.

I also notice in the photos that it looks like you are only using one input on the AI8.  You could perhaps get rid of this module completely by using the AI on the D16A3.

cheers, Aus

I just realized that npn/pnp field exists.  I never had to change it before. Is it really relevant or just to visual indication?

[kratmel]

Hi,

Please calculate max power supply current for original and new installation.

Maybe more installed output need extra power? 

 

 

[Flex727]

1 hour ago, Gabriel Franco said:

I just realized that npn/pnp field exists.  I never had to change it before. Is it really relevant or just to visual indication?

I want to know the answer to this also. I've never found it to actually do anything. If you change that setting and nothing else, VisiLogic will indicate that the program you're downloading is identical to the one in the PLC and abort the download. I say it's just a convenient visual indicator for the programmer/user.

[Colodeti]

5 hours ago, kratmel said:

Oi,

Calcule a corrente máxima da fonte de alimentação para a instalação original e nova.

Talvez mais saídas instaladas precisem de energia extra? 

 

 

dear

already replaces the source for a 10A and the failure occurred anyway

[Colodeti]

9 hours ago, Ausman said:

Tem certeza de que a fiação está correta para NPN ou PNP e TAMBÉM a seleção NPN / PNP foi feita corretamente na configuração de hardware do projeto? 

A seleção PNP / NPN está na coluna esquerda da guia Entradas digitais em Configuração de hardware e é facilmente perdida. Uma vez feito, você deve compilar isso, salvar como novo, recarregá-lo no controlador e executar uma Init e Reset.

Também noto nas fotos que parece que você está usando apenas uma entrada no AI8. Talvez você possa se livrar completamente deste módulo usando a IA no D16A3.

Saúde, Aus

 

dear

if the fault was NPN or PNP wiring, I believe it would have occurred previously on the IO-DI16 card. As for the analog input I kept the IO-AI8 card after it includes the D16A3 card for issues related to AI8 and 14 bit resolution

[Ausman]

Flex & Gabriel, I've always done it just as a matter of course.  Have never considered it to be just an indicator...always thought it crucial.  Can't experiment whether it actually DOES anything at present.

Colodetti,  1).  I thought perhaps the resolution might be the reason, but suggested anyway.

                         2).  OK on NPN/PNP but still think you should very carefully check everything and try.

                         3).  What happens if you drop the rest of the I/Os off, and just have the D16A3?   Not hard to do as just a trial program.  Doesn't have to have anything in it, just the correct hardware configuration for it on it's own.  Slide the other modules along a bit so you can disconnect the cable, then try with power to them connected AND disconnected.

cheers, Aus

[DanT]

Hi;

Looking at the picture you posted of the new installation.

   Further to Alex's Post -  System is not plug and play

    POSITION is VERY IMPORTANT

        Do You Understand how Unitronics I/O Module addressing is done when you use the EX-A2X Expansion Module?

Now post an image -Screen Shot of the VisiLogic Hardware configuration of the system .

         VisiLogic - View HW_configuration.

Where is the module placed in the configuration? 

Is this replacing and existing module, or added?

If it is replacing an existing module - what was the previous module?

      or did you slide the existing modules over and add this one at the beginning?

           If it was added as the picture is shown, then ALL the rest of your I/O addressing is now messed up!

  

Please

Now post an image -Screen Shot of the VisiLogic Hardware configuration of the system .

         VisiLogic - View  - HW_configuration.

  I am curious.

 

DanT

 

 

 

[Colodeti]

21 hours ago, DanT said:

Oi;

Olhando para a foto que você postou da nova instalação.

   Além do Post de Alex - O sistema não é plug and play

    A POSIÇÃO É MUITO IMPORTANTE

        Você entende como o endereçamento do módulo de E / S da Unitronics é feito quando você usa o módulo de expansão EX-A2X?

Agora poste uma imagem -Screen Shot da configuração do hardware VisiLogic do sistema.

         VisiLogic - Veja HW_configuration.

Onde o módulo está colocado na configuração? 

Este módulo está substituindo e existente ou adicionado?

Se estiver substituindo um módulo existente - qual era o módulo anterior?

      ou você deslizou os módulos existentes e adicionou este no início?

           Se foi adicionado como a imagem é mostrada, todo o restante do seu endereçamento de E / S está agora bagunçado!

  

Por favor

Agora poste uma imagem -Screen Shot da configuração do hardware VisiLogic do sistema.

         VisiLogic - View - HW_configuration.

  Estou curioso.

 

DanT

 

 

 

dear

follows the before and after image. after adding the DA16A3 card I did all the address correction in the project (software)

[kratmel]

Hi, some quastion for you:

1) Where error is appear

- after PLC start?

- after start no error - it is appear at working mode?

- error is generated when some input or autput on new module activated?

 

2) Is it possible that new I/O module do not start to working mode before PLC start.

Please do separate power on for PLC and IO (use rotary button ect.). 

Start IO module, wait for green led blinked on all module - then power PLC.  Result?

 

3) Is it all connected to new module relay has RC filter  (on 220VAC) or diode (24VDC) on coil?

Please post relay installation  foto.

 

4) Is it possible that some of used interface relay has wrong contact diagram and 24VDC connected to 220VAC?

I find some problem in one installation - two 8A contact relay is used for operate  24VDC and 220VAC - operator try to replace relay with the "same" but with only one 16A contact - plc input is overloaded and machine lost plc control.

 

Please disconnect all IO-D16A3-RO16output connection and restart system. Result?

Please disconnect all IO-D16A3-RO16 input  connection and restart system. Result?

[Colodeti]

On 07/07/2020 at 23:15, Joe Tauser said:

Considerando que você está recebendo um erro de expansão com um cabo fabricado em casa, eu o substituiria. Você já passou mais tempo solucionando problemas com isso do que os custos com cabos.

 

Joe T.

 

dear Joe T
I believe you killed the charade. I did the installation of the original cable provisionally yesterday and today there was no error. I will monitor the operation next week. But I already tell you that the failure was occurring every day at least twice.

[Ausman]

Yay for you and Joe!  The cable is very important to do properly, and ENSURE you couple up the earth correctly.

This morning I had a brainwave that perhaps you needed to ensure the 1210 was on the latest firmware, but it looks like that isn't needed now. 

cheers, Aus

[Colodeti]

2 hours ago, kratmel said:

Olá, alguma dúvida para você:

1) Onde o erro é exibido

- após o início do PLC?

- após iniciar nenhum erro - ele aparece no modo de trabalho?

- erro é gerado quando alguma entrada ou entrada automática no novo módulo é ativada?

 

2) É possível que o novo módulo de E / S não entre no modo de trabalho antes do início do PLC.

Por favor, ligue a alimentação separada para PLC e IO (use o botão rotativo ect.). 

Inicie o módulo IO, aguarde o LED verde piscar em todos os módulos - depois ligue o CLP. Resultado?

 

3) Está tudo conectado ao novo relé do módulo com filtro RC (em 220VAC) ou diodo (24VDC) na bobina?

Poste a foto da instalação do relé.

 

4) É possível que algum relé de interface usado tenha um diagrama de contato errado e 24VDC conectado a 220VAC?

Encontro algum problema em uma instalação - dois relés de contato 8A são usados para operar 24VCC e 220VCA - o operador tenta substituir o relé pelo " mesmo", mas com apenas uma entrada de 16A - a entrada plc está sobrecarregada e a máquina perde o controle plc.

 

Desconecte toda a conexão de saída IO-D16A3-RO16 e reinicie o sistema. Resultado?

Desconecte toda a conexão de entrada IO-D16A3-RO16 e reinicie o sistema. Resultado?

dear

the failure occurs during program execution. It does not always occur at the same point, it occurs at random times. I already released the connectors of the D16A3 module and replaced the relays, even so the failure occurred. Replaces the interconnection cable between the V1210 and the EX-A2X module and apparently the failure is no longer occurring

[Colodeti]

2 hours ago, Ausman said:

Yay para você e Joe! O cabo é muito importante para executar corretamente e ASSEGURA que você acople a terra corretamente.

Esta manhã, tive uma onda cerebral de que talvez você precisasse garantir que o 1210 estivesse no firmware mais recente, mas parece que isso não é necessário agora. 

Saúde, Aus

dear
what is the latest firmware for the V1210?